Habte (Ca) wrote:
{{{{{{{
>In the late sixties and early seventies, one felt that to be a
>revolutionary one had to be a Marxist or with socialist tendencies. The
communist camps aided you in achieving your goals if you adhered to
their camp. The Eritrean revolution was no exception. EPLF did not tell
us
here to read Marxist books, but it was the thing to do. Since the
Ethiopian
regime initially was a client of a capitalist country, it was the feeling
of a lot
of us that the Eritrean movements had to belong to the other camp -- the
socialist one. The EPLF did not design this, it was the dictates of the
period.
>When historical conditions changed, EPLF also changed its position. I
see no arrogance here. Actually, I see only maturity
}}}}}
Habte. You make very good observations. The above statements are
probably a correct assessment. What does that tell us, however? It
tells us that the EPLF/PFDJ, like any organization, can make mistakes not
only in logistics and administration but also in such vital matters as
our
nation's political philosophy. Nevertheless that is history now and the
damage was done. Even after that, we can perhaps forgive them for
this monumental mistake had they learned their lesson and refrained
from monopolizing the decision-making process. On the contrary, the
PFDJ, in practice, still acts as if its vision is the only road to
success
and as if those who disagree are enemies of our people bent on retarding
reconstruction efforts.
You say above that "EPLF did not tell us here to read Marxist books, but
it
was the thing to do."
Habte: It doesn't have to tell us to 'read Marxist books',. Worse. It
may have
made us THINK, LIVE and DIE marxist style. Doing things because ' it
was
the thing to do' until you get burned is an infantile behavior and is
neither the
characteristics of good leaders nor the attitude of intelligent followers
- if that
was indeed the real rationale behind the infatuation with Marxism.
Fisseha:
you wrote:
{{{{{{
Habte, you better be warned, ismail has his way with words.
He is capable of saying no and yes in one sentence.
}}}}}}
That is not difficult to do, Habte. You just did it above in your last
sentence.
Seriously though, I would like to know how you reached that
conclusion. By God, if I have become so evasive and so ambiguous
in my writing, I certainly would like to know. That would be more
helpful to me than just throwing that sentence. If on the other hand
this is an emotional reaction to my post, I understand and sympathize
with you.
you also wrote:
{{{{{{
It is a pity that such ability in language construction and
idea manipulation is wasted to justify Islam as the only good
religion. I have no problem with the religion; I have great
respect for those followers of that faith; I may even convert to
it unless Ismail objects that I was not "created a muslim".
He does not realise that I am a Christian because I was only born
on the other side of the village.
}}}}}
Fisseha. According to Islam, you were 'created a muslim'. So,
don't worry, if you ever chose to become a Muslim, the door is
wide open and I would be the first to welcome you and your first
lesson would be to treat followers of other religions with love and
respect. It is entirely possible that my own ancestor was
from the same village you came from. But despite that fact,
some chose to become Muslims and others to become Christians
despite their origins. In other words, though your roots may determine
your early religion, as an adult, you should not be tied to your village
unless you chose to. But I see your reasoning.
you said 'go home and take the wheel if you have enough
constitutents to vote for you ! In 1998 or 1999 !'
Can I at least count on your vote then, Fisseha?
Beraki:
you wrote:
{{{{{{
Bro Ismail could you explain to me that why only the Muslims were
vulnerable by what you called snaching of young people? or the mighty
EPLF only snached away young Muslims from thier parents? was this
only paractied by EPLF?
}}}}}}
I have already explained why I thought Muslims were vulnerable (refer
to my earlier post.) No. both Christians and Muslims were 'snatched
away'. But remember I was discussing how 'Jihad' may have originated
which doesn't apply to Christians. Muslims, due to tradition and
religious
guidelines are more protective of their daughters. Hence, their reaction
was more fierce. Don't forget also that they were not just objecting to
the abduction, but were more worried about the indoctrination.
your brother
Ismail
On Mon, 22 Sep 1997 03:40:18 -0400 (EDT) HabteSE@AOL.COM writes:
>Selam Ismail and dehaiers,
>
>In the late sixties and early seventies, one felt that to be a
>revolutionary
>one had to be a Marxist or with socialist tendencies. The communist
>camps
>aided you in achieving your goals if you adhered to their camp. The
>Eritrean
>revolution was no exception. EPLF did not tell us here to read Marxist
>books,
>but it was the thing to do. Since the Ethiopian regime initially was a
>client
>of a capitalist country, it was the feeling of a lot of us that the
>Eritrean
>movements had to belong to the other camp -- the socialist one. The
>EPLF did
>not design this, it was the dictates of the period.
>When historical conditions changed, EPLF also changed its position. I
>see no
>arrogance here. Actually, I see only maturity. Besides, I think you,
>Ismail,
>are overestimating the intellectual depth of the framers of EPLF had
>at the
>time. These "leaders of EPLF" were just young and average Eritreans,
>with
>steeped nationalism, but products of the schools of Asmara -- with all
>their
>shortcomings and strengths.
>They were just doing the best they can with what they had.
>
>As for the impact of the socialist orientation of the EPLF on the
>religious
>traditions of the people in Eritrea, it is very difficult to say
>because the
>Mengistu regime also had its own share of socialist inclinations.
>Whether the
>impact is good or bad for the society is not the subject of this
>discussion,
>of course.
>
>But the following quote from your post is instructing:
>
>> .........Some have linked its [Jihad's] actual origin
>> with the abduction of young daughters from Muslim families even
>> though it may have originated earlier. Unfortunately the EPLF/PFDJ
>> still persists with this non chalant attitude and seems to totally
>> misunderstand the psychology of Muslims.
>
>Is the "EPLF/PFDJ" also " abducting..young daughters from Muslim
>families" ?
>For what purpose ? For Sawa ?
>
>habte, (Calif.)
>******************************************************************************
>******
>In a message dated 97-09-22 02:01:00 EDT, you write:
>
>> Subj: Re: [DEHAI] "Sudan...war against Eritrea".. / Ismail's
>> Date: 97-09-22 02:01:00 EDT
>> From: ismail1@JUNO.COM (Ismail Omar-Al)
>> Sender: owner-dehai@ftp1.primenet.com
>> Reply-to: ismail1@JUNO.COM (Ismail Omar-Al)
>> To: HabteSE@AOL.COM
>> CC: Dehai@primenet.com
>>
>> Selamat Habte, Yekaalo and seb dehai
>>
>> you wrote:
>> {{{{{{{
>> What exactly are these "deep-seated cultural/religious sentiments",
>
>> Ismail ? It would be very beneficial to me, and may be to others as
>well,
>> if we
>> truly >understand and discuss the "cultural/religious sentiments"
>of some
>>
>> segments>of the Eritrean people and how these "sentiments" were "
>> arrogantly dismissed" by the "EPLF/PFDJ". It serves no purpose to
>talk
>> about the Turabis of foreign lands, when we could be talking
>critically
>> about our own Turabis, who "arrogantly dismiss" "deep-seated
>...religious
>>
>> sentiments" of their own people.
>> }}}}}
>>
>> Habte:
>>
>> Eritreans are a deeply religious people. They have believed for
>> centuries
>> in certain mores and values derived from their religion and were
>able to
>> evolve a culture that was a mixture of high moral principles and
>> superstitions. The life of the average Eritrean revolved around
>some
>> form of religious symbolism. There was hardly any event to
>> which Eritreans did not attach a religious significance. The birth,
>the
>> marriage and the death of each individual was solemnly observed
>with
>> prayers, supplications and thanks giving. Even routine activities
>like
>> Eating
>> and sleeping were followed by thanks to the source of these
>amenities.
>>
>> This was until the cruel circumstances of history brought leaders
>> who would succumb easily to alien philosophies without any serious
>> independent thinking and without due consideration to the tradition
>
>> and culture of their own people. They readily imbibed the doomed
>> philosophy of Marxism and attempted to overhaul centuries old
>> traditions and religious sentiments overnight. Since they failed
>> to make any significant headway in this attempt, they targeted
>> innocent youths and took them away early from their families
>> and indoctrinated them with their adapted ideology This proved
>very
>> effective and the young generation now seems indifferent to
>religion
>> and with the demise of communism - very disoriented.
>>
>> It was as if our people were told 'hey you fools, stop your foolish
>> ceremonies and follow us because we have found a formula for
>> successful living.' Many people innocently followed them and this
>> was to result in a moral confusion that still persists to this
>> day. Those very leaders were to come back later and tell us
>> oops! we goofed! We were on the wrong track all along but
>> that didn't happen until their mentors ignominiously fell over the
>> cliff!
>>
>> It was of course in the name of liberation and false enlightenment
>
>> that they snatched young people away from their parents. Many
>> parents who sent their youth to fight for liberation were not happy
>
>> at this indoctrination. Some protested but the mighty EPLF totally
>
>> disregarded their concerns. EPLF's arrogance did not make it pause
>
>> to question the appropriateness of its methodology as applied to
>> different segments of our society. Muslims were particularly
>vulnerable
>> in this regard.
>>
>> Many Muslims remember vividly how Haile Selassie targeted
>> them for their religion and how he totally ignored their specific
>> concerns. Many Muslims naturally expected EPLF to be more
>> understanding about their religious sentiments. Imagine how
>> they felt when it too totally disregarded their traditions. Some
>> were infuriated and thus were the seeds of future Jihad
>> became planted, in my opinion. Some have linked its actual origin
>> with the abduction of young daughters from Muslim families even
>> though it may have originated earlier. Unfortunately the EPLF/PFDJ
>> still persists with this non chalant attitude and seems to totally
>> misunderstand the psychology of Muslims.
>>
>>
>> Yekaalo:
>>
>> you wrote:
>> {{{{{
>> Question: Where did the Eritrean Jihad get 'invented' ?
>> Hard facts in support of your opinion will definitely
>> change my opinion and maybe Million's, too.
>> }}}}}}
>>
>> First, I sincerely thank you for your compliments and for
>> your very valid comments. Here is what I said:
>>
>> <<Finally, the idea that Jihad was invented abroad is self-delusion
>on
>> the part of the Government, in my opinion.>>
>>
>> Yekaalo - If you read my statements above, you will notice that
>> this is my personal opiinion. If there were 'hard facts' that can
>> clearly establish the origin of this movement, then there would
>> be no opinions - but facts. We can reasonably deduce, however,
>> that all its leaders and fighters are Eritreans some of whom were
>> members of ELF and there might even be some former EPLF's.
>> Believe me, Yekaalo, if there was a shred of evidence to prove that
>
>> Jihad was invented abroad, the PFDJ would have presented it
>> long time ago. .
>>
>> your brother
>>
>> Ismail
>
>